Sunday, September 25, 2011

Dood : Abtirsinyada Gadabuursi Samaroon Mandaluug Dir

Dood : Abtirsinyada Gadabuursi Samaroon Mandaluug Dir


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Gudabursi...

by Shabelle on Fri Feb 26, 2010 8:37 pm

A Little Explanation At The Bottom

Jibracin Saciid, Gobe Saciid & Samaroon Saciid are Brothers


*Jibracin Saciid (Reer Jibracin)


*Gobe Saciid
-Xildiid
-Salaan
-Muse


*Samaroon Saciid

-Isse Samaroon (Reer Isse)

-Yusuf Samaroon (Habar Yaasif)

-Subeer Samaroon
>>Dhego Weyne
>>Makal (Makayl Qaylo)
>>>Muse Subeer
>>>>Musefin
>>>>>Ismaaciil
>>>>>>Reer Cabdille
>>>>>>>Gadhcad
>>>>>>>Gadhweyn
>>>>>>Idaar
>>>>>>Ali Ugaadh
>>>>>Reer Abdi
>>>>Reer Hamud
>>>>Hassan Sa'ad
>>>>>Reer Rooble
>>>>Faroole


............................................................................................

-Saciid Samaroon
>>Makadoor Saciid Samaroon

Makadoor Saciid Had Two Sons::: Makahiil Makadoor & Mohammed Makadoor (Mahad Case)


>Makahiil Makadoor
>>Ciye Makahiil
>>Celi Makahiil
>>Abdalle Makahiil (Bahabr Abdalle)
>>Hassan Makahiil (Bahabar Hasan)

>>Muuse Makahii
>>>Jibriil Muuse (Afguduud)
>>>Idris Muuse (Bah Sanayo)
>>>Rooble Muuse (Bah Sanayo)
>>>Hawaday Muuse (Bah Sanayo)

>>>Makayl-Dheere
>>>>Reer Ugaas
>>>>>Ugaas Samatar
>>>>>Ugaas Cabdille
>>>>Reer Abokor
>>>>>Reer Galaangal
>>>>>Reer Abdi Abokor

>>>Yoonis Muuse

>>>>Jibril Yoonis
>>>>>Adan (Had) Jabril
>>>>>Abokr (Gorad) Jabril
>>>>>Ahmed Cismaan Kheyr Jabril (Reer Ahmed)
>>>>>Ali Khair (Kaba Harag)
>>>>>>Dudub Osman (Reer Dudub)
>>>>>>>Hodaal Dudub
>>>>>>>Dharaar Dudub
>>>>>>>Cigaal Dudub
>>>>>>>Dadar Dudub
>>>>>>>Aadan Dudub
>>>>>>Yoonis Osman
>>>>>>>Farah Yunus-Ba Madigan
>>>>>>>Ahmed Yunus-Ba Madigan
>>>>>>>Mahmud Yunus-Ba Musa Fin
>>>>>>>Darar Yonis-Ba Musa Fin
>>>>>>>Geleh Yonis-Ba Musa Fin
>>>>>>Gadaala-Dhal
>>>>>>>Abdi Yonis-Gadaladal
>>>>>>>Gedi Yonis-Gadaladal
>>>>>>>Adan Yonis-Gadaladal
>>>>>>>Ali Yonis-Gadaladal
>>>>>>>Hamud Yonis



>>>>Nuur Yoonis (Reer Nuur)

>>>>>Mohamoud Nuur

>>>>>>Abdi Mohamoud
>>>>>>>Cismaan Abdi (Reer Cismaan)
>>>>>>>Hussien Abdi
>>>>>>>>Xaad Hussien
>>>>>>>>Shirdoon Hussien
>>>>>>>>Gabbal Hussien
>>>>>>>>>Koohi Gabbal
>>>>>>>>>Samatar Gabbal
>>>>>>>>>Ali Gabbal
>>>>>>>>>Raage Gabbal
>>>>>>>>>Xerge Gabbal
>>>>>>>>>Khayre (bah-caso)
>>>>>>>>>Bahdoon (bah-caso)
>>>>>>>>>Samatar-yare (bah-caso)
>>>>>>>>>Dhaabur (bah-caso

>>>>>>Halas Mohamoud (Reer Halas)
>>>>>>> Cumar Halas
>>>>>>>>Husien Cumar
>>>>>>>>Farah Cumar
>>>>>>>>Gelleh Omar
>>>>>>>>Roble Omar
>>>>>>>>Afi Cumar
>>>>>>>>>Galab Afi
>>>>>>>Muse Halas
>>>>>>>Hiraab Halas
>>>>>>>Ali Halas
>>>>>>>>Reer Boqore
>>>>>>>>Reer Rooble Ali
>>>>>>>Guled Halas
>>>>>>>>Qoob Buur

>>>>>>Hufane Mohamoud (Nimidoor)

>>>>>>Hassan Mohamoud (Nimidoor)
>>>>>>>Reer Dharaar
>>>>>>>Odawa Hassan

>>>>>>Rooble Mohamoud (Bah Jibracin)
>>>>>>>Reer Geele
>>>>>>>Reer Dhabbar
>>>>>>>Reer Abdulahi
>>>>>>>Reer Ali Karuure

>>>>>>Mohammed Mohamoud (Bah Jibracin)
>>>>>>>Reer Buuh
>>>>>>>Reer Jirde


>>>>>Farah Nuur (Reer Farah Nuur)

>>>>>>Reer Ali Abdi

>>>>>>Ibrahim Farah
>>>>>>>Gaade Ibraahim
>>>>>>>Guled Ibraahim
>>>>>>>Samakaab Ibraahim
>>>>>>>Rooble Ibraahim
>>>>>>>Dadar Ibraahim
>>>>>>>Salah Ibraahim
>>>>>>>Bare Ibraahim
>>>>>>>>Reer Waadhawr

>>>>>>Geedi Farah (Gabarmadow)
>>>>>>>Hiraab Geedi
>>>>>>>Cali Geedi
>>>>>>>Mahamed Geedi
>>>>>>>Dabeer Geedi
>>>>>>>Wayteen Geedi




>Mohammed Makadoor (Mahad Case)

>>Bahabar Eli
>>>Cabdalle
>>>Habar Xuseen
>>>Maxamuud

>>Bahabar Adam

>>Bahabar Abokor
>>>Reer Siciid

>>Muuse Mohammed

>>>Bahabar Muuse
>>>>Ali Madoobe
>>>>Madax Madoobe
>>>>Akaraa

>>>Abrayn
>>>>Ali Hogol
>>>>Geesaale

>>>Reer Mohamed
>>>>Reer Aadan
>>>>Reer buux cumar
>>>>Reer cigaal

>>>Adam Muuse

Last edited by Shabelle on Sat Feb 27, 2010 5:28 am, edited 3 times in total.
Shabelle Posts: 5Joined: Fri Feb 26, 2010 6:51 pm
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Re: Gudabursi...

by Shabelle on Fri Feb 26, 2010 8:57 pm

The Habar Afaan Clan From Gudabursi Do Not Come From A Single Descendant, But Rather They Are Many Clans That Have Come Together To Form An Alliance.

Because Each Of The Clans in Habar Afaan Are Not As Large As The Descendants of Saciid Samaroon, so They Formed An Alliance In Order To Become as Big as The Descendants Of Saciid Samaroon (Makahiil & Mahad Case).

These Clans Are:

-Gobe Saciid, (Which Is The Brother Of Samaroon Saciid)

-Jibracin Saciid (Also The Brother Of Samaroon Saciid)

-Isse Samaroon (Son Of Samaroon Saciid)

-Yusuf Samaroon (Son Of Samaroon Saciid)

-Subeer Samaroon (Son Of Samaroon Saciid)


*There Are Two Other Clans In Habar Afaan That Are Called::
-Ali Ganuun (Which Is From A Darood Clan, But They Have Integrated Into The Gadabursi Clan)

-Xeebjire(Which Is From The Shiekhaal Clan, & They Have Also Integrated Into The Gadabursi Clan)

These Two Clans Joined The Habar Afaan Alliance.




-And Then There Is Saciid Samaroon, His Son Is:
Makadoor Saciid and Then::

Makahiil Makadoor Saciid Samaroon Saciid (Makahiil)
&
Mohammed Makadoor Saciid Samaroon Saciid (Also Known As Mahad Case).



I Hope That Explains It.
Shabelle Posts: 5Joined: Fri Feb 26, 2010 6:51 pm
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Re: Gudabursi...

by James Dahl on Thu Mar 04, 2010 11:08 pm

Ok I've been working my way through what you've posted, I've got most of it in the database

Let me know if I've made any mistakes
James DahlSite Admin Posts: 88Joined: Mon Oct 06, 2008 5:19 am
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Re: Gudabursi...

by Shabelle on Tue Mar 09, 2010 1:36 am

After Makadoor It's Mohammed (Mahad Case) & Makahiil... There Is No "ase" or "Maxaad"

And The Part Were It Says Dir Had 4 Sons Is Wrong, It's Mahe, Madaxweyne, Madobe & Mandaluug,, There Is No "Maaladuuqa"...lol
And Samaroon Is A Descendant Of Mandaluug, Not Maahe,, But I'll Get The Abtirsi From Samaroon Siciid To Dir.
Shabelle Posts: 5Joined: Fri Feb 26, 2010 6:51 pm
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Re: Gudabursi...

by James Dahl on Tue Mar 09, 2010 10:18 pm



Shabelle wrote:After Makadoor It's Mohammed (Mahad Case) & Makahiil... There Is No "ase" or "Maxaad"

And The Part Were It Says Dir Had 4 Sons Is Wrong, It's Mahe, Madaxweyne, Madobe & Mandaluug,, There Is No "Maaladuuqa"...lol
And Samaroon Is A Descendant Of Mandaluug, Not Maahe,, But I'll Get The Abtirsi From Samaroon Siciid To Dir.


I will fix this problem with Makadoor

Regarding Madaluug, are you sure? I've seen quite a few abtiris that count: Madaluug Maxamed Xanaftire Maahe DirJames DahlSite Admin Posts: 88Joined: Mon Oct 06, 2008 5:19 am
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Re: Gudabursi...

by burdi on Wed Mar 24, 2010 11:11 am

james,

don't believe this shabelle guy his not even somaron so how he can help you about samaron abtirsi or sub clans of samaron. there are no such people in gadabuursi tribe who are originally are darod or shekhail, all the sub calans of gadabuursi tribe are decent from Ali Madaluug the man who's his nick name is Gadabuursi.

here are some new information to you if you are really need to improve or update your data.
Samaroon has four sons Makadoor, Isse, Yousuf and Subeer. Samaroon has no such clan named makadoor siciid samaroon. but it is makadoor samaroon siciid.
also there is 2 generations missing between daa'uud and madaluug.
also there is wrong information about samatar-yare in reer nuur clan, there is two brothers with same name samatar so to to distinguish between the two the older one called samatar-weyne(the big samatar in somali) which i decent from, and the little one called samatar-yare(the little samatar in somali)

Samaroon lineage
Mahmoud(his nick name is samaroon)
Sa'ed
Daa'uud
Hassan
Umar
Ali(his nick name is gadabuursi) it is Ali madaluug Cali in somali not Celi
Madaluug

Last edited by burdi on Sat Aug 07, 2010 6:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
burdi Posts: 6Joined: Wed Mar 17, 2010 10:45 pm
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Re: Gudabursi...

by James Dahl on Wed Mar 24, 2010 8:52 pm

burdi,
Thank you for explaining that, that helps a lot

I have added your abtiris here:
http://www.abtirsi.com/view.php?person=4570
James DahlSite Admin Posts: 88Joined: Mon Oct 06, 2008 5:19 am
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Re: Gudabursi...

by burdi on Sat Aug 07, 2010 6:47 pm

1. UGAAS CALI MAKAAHIIL
2. UGAAS CABDI UGAAS CALI
3. UGAAS XUSEEN (UGAADH) UGAAS CABDI
4. UGAAS CABDILLE UGAAS CABDI
5. UGAAS NUUR UGAAS CABDI
6. UGAAS HIRAAB UGAAS NUUR
7. UGAAS SHIRDOON UGAAS NUUR
8. UGAAS SAMATAR UGAAS SHIRDOON
9. UGAAS GUULLEED UGAAS SAMATAR
10. UGAAS ROOBLE UGAAS SAMATAR
11. UGAAS NUUR UGAAS ROOBLE
12. UGAAS ROOBLE UGAAS NUUR
13. UGAAS CILMI-WARFAA UGAAS ROOBLE UGAAS SAMATAR (CILMI-DHEERE)
14. UGAAS CABDI UGAAS ROOBLE UGAAS NUUR
15. UGAAS DOODI
16. UGAAS ROOBLE UGAAS DOODI
17. UGAAS JAAMAC MUXUMAD
18. UGAAS CABDILRASHIID UGAAS ROOBLE


1. UGAAS CABDIRRASHID (now he is the Gadabuursi Ugaas)
2. UGAAS ROOBLE
3. UGAAS DOODI
4. UGAAS CABDI
5. UGAAS ROOBLE
6. UGAAS NUUR
7. UGAAS ROOBLE
8. UGAAS SAMATAR
9. UGAAS SHIRDOON
10. UGAAS NUUR
11. UGAAS CABDI
12. UGAAS CALI
13. MAKAHIIL (Dheere)
14. MUUSE (Derri)
15. MAKAAHIIL
16. MAKADOOR
17. MAXMUUD (SAMAROON)
18. SICIID
19. DAA'UUD
20. XASAN
21. CUMAR
22. CALI (GEDO-BIIRSI)
23. MADALUUG
burdi Posts: 6Joined: Wed Mar 17, 2010 10:45 pm
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Re: Gudabursi...

by James Dahl on Mon Aug 09, 2010 7:44 pm

Thank you burdi, I have added the information.

The 17th Ugaas, Jaamac Muxumad, do you know what his abtiris was?
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Re: Gudabursi...

by burdi on Tue Oct 05, 2010 2:01 pm



James Dahl wrote:Thank you burdi, I have added the information.

The 17th Ugaas, Jaamac Muxumad, do you know what his abtiris was?


you are welcome

about ugaas Muxumed i'm not sure about his abtirsi but i'll search it.

one thing else GADABUURSI or MADALUUG in general are not part of MAHE DIRR, they are descent from DIRR directly some poeple says it is MADALUUG DIRR (MADALUUG is son of DIRR) while other says no it is MADALUUG AHMED DIRR (MADALUUG is grandson of DIRR) only ALLAH knows. so please correct your data..

MAHE DIRR is SURRE, GAADSAN, MIYOMAAL, and ISAAQ









Re: Gudabursi...

by burdi on Tue Oct 05, 2010 2:01 pm



James Dahl wrote:Thank you burdi, I have added the information.

The 17th Ugaas, Jaamac Muxumad, do you know what his abtiris was?


you are welcome

about ugaas Muxumed i'm not sure about his abtirsi but i'll search it.

one thing else GADABUURSI or MADALUUG in general are not part of MAHE DIRR, they are descent from DIRR directly some poeple says it is MADALUUG DIRR (MADALUUG is son of DIRR) while other says no it is MADALUUG AHMED DIRR (MADALUUG is grandson of DIRR) only ALLAH knows. so please correct your data..

MAHE DIRR is SURRE, GAADSAN, MIYOMAAL, and ISAAQburdi Posts: 6Joined: Wed Mar 17, 2010 10:45 pm
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Re: Gudabursi...

by James Dahl on Fri Oct 08, 2010 6:30 am

My dear burdi,

The biggest issue for me is that the abtiris for Gadabursi seems too short if Madaluug is a son of Dir. Sheikh Samaroon is alive when the Ethiopian Army invaded Ifat in 1415, and Dir is a contemporary of Darood who, judging from the length of the Abtirsi amongst Darood, lived around the year 1000.

The Sons of Dir, for instance, are given as Madahweyne, Madaluug, Madoobe and Mahe. If the abtirsi of Sheikh Samaroon traces Maxamuud Saciid Daa'uud Xassan Cumar Cali Madaluug Dir, then that means the 400 years seperating Dir from Sheikh Samaroon would be 50 years per generation! This is not possible. Perhaps for one generation or two it would be 50 years, but that would be averaged out by the very short generations of 20 years and the average ones of 30 years to end up at about 32 years per generation, which is the average period between generations.

However, there is a tradition that exists that Madaluug is not a SON of Dir, but rather a great-grandson, via Maahe. This tradition states that Madaluug traces his abtirsi thusly: Madaluug Maxamed Xanaftire Maahe Dir.

If we run with this alternate tradition, Sheikh Samaroon traces Maxamuud Saciid Daa'uud Xassan Cumar Cali Madaluug Maxamed Xanaftire Maahe Dir, which is 11 generations. This results in 36 years per generation, which are long generations but much more plausible than the 50 years per generation.

It is for this reason that I have chosen to place Madaluug as a son of Maxamed Xanaftire Maahe Dir rather than Dir himself, as if not for this alternate tradition of descent, I would be looking for 3-6 missing generations in the Samaroon family tree.

However Xanaftire's two sons, Axmed and Maxamed, are terribly confused with one another in many traditions, some going so far as to say Axmed is another name for Maxamed, probably because Maxamed Xanaftire also had a son named Axmed. Perhaps the tradition that it is Madaluug Axmed Dir is a clue? I do not know. The Dir abtirsi is the most difficult for me to trace.

I hope I have explained my reasoning and why I have placed Madaluug as a son of Maxamed (possibly Axmed?) Xanaftire, it will no doubt prove to be a controversial decision and one I am not against being proven wrong on.

- James Dahl
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Re: Gudabursi...

by burdi on Fri Oct 08, 2010 12:29 pm

Dear James,

you are absolutely right about the abtirsi of Gadabuursi people being short compared to Hawiye abtirsi or even most of Darod clans abtirsi, but if you compared with northern people like Isaaq, Isse or Akishe there is no big differences. and what northern clans made their abtirsi very short compared to southern people are northern people married or used to marry older than southern people still in our days you can see 18 old boy having children in south in east or central regions people also marry at young ages but not lie south.
in west where i came from before 1940's men used to marry at very old ages between 40-50.

for example Akishe and Isse are older than Gadabuursi and they count same or less to Dirr same goes to Isaaq.
most Samaroon people counts between 18 to 22 to Samaroon. for me i count 19 to Samaroon (excluding myself) and if i add to myself it is 20 and if i calculate it 2010-1400 = is around 600 years if we divided to 22(max) is around 28 years and if divided to 16(min) we get 38 years.



sheikh Samaroon is alive when the Ethiopian Army invaded Ifat in 1415, and Dir is a contemporary of Darood who, judging from the length of the Abtirsi amongst Darood, lived around the year 1000.

yes, it is true that Samaroon live at that time according to somali history my great grandfather sh. NUUR YOONIS lived the same time Ahmed Gurey lived. and it is not true that Darod lived the year 1000 i mean it is not possible how on earth some people count less than 30 generations (which most of Darod people do) to some guy who lived 1000+ years i think dirr, darod and hawiye lived either the same time or within a century.

one thing else northern people used to say Samaroon is Madaluug Dirr, Isse is Madoobe Dirr and Isaaq is Mohamed Dirr that doesn't necessary mean Madaluug, Madoobe, and Mohamed are the sons of Dirr nor it means Samaroon is the son of Madaluug.
Last edited by burdi on Fri Oct 08, 2010 12:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Gudabursi...

by burdi on Fri Oct 08, 2010 12:29 pm

D/P
burdi Posts: 6Joined: Wed Mar 17, 2010 10:45 pm
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Re: Gudabursi...

by James Dahl on Fri Oct 08, 2010 7:08 pm

My dear burdi,

You are right that Isaaq count roughly the same number of generations to Sheikh Isaaq as Samaroon count to Sheikh Samaroon, which is roughly 20 generations or a few less.

There is another chronological issue as well though with placing Madaluug as a son of Dir (3 generations back) rather than Maxamed Xanaftire that I forgot to mention previously. The mother of Habar Garxajis branch of Isaaq, Garxajis Madaluug, would be far too old to marry Sheikh Isaaq's son Ismaciil Isaaq, though perhaps I am missing a few generations there?

For instance your abtirsi, your abtirsi to Sheikh Samaroon averages 30 years (600/20), precisely the average for an abtirsi, so with the men marrying at the age of 50 there must also be several of your ancestors who married at the age of 20 and everything in between, your abtirsi says that northern abtirsi should be just as long as southern ones, with their 30 year average generations.

So then we are left with an open question, why are Dir abtirsi shorter than other Irir, or Darood, who are their contemporaries? This is a difficult question to answer. There are between 5-10 generations that are "missing". There are a few possibilities:

One possibility is that Dir's sons are not exactly his sons but descendants of his, but the generations between Dir and the next important branching of the Dir family tree are less important and thus skipped over. This happens with the Hiraab Hawiye, who often skip straght from Hiraab to Daame Gorgaate Hawiye, even though there are actually 5 generations in between Hiraab and Daame, and also with Dulbahante where they skip over a whole 9 generations between Saciid (Dulbahante) and the first branching of their family tree, which is why the Dulbahante abtirsi is famously short. If we say that there are 5 "lost" generations between Dir and Maahe for instance and we also assume that Madaluug is a son of Maxamed Xanaftire then we have found our 8 missing generations. Or, if like the Dulbahante, Madaluug is a son of Dir but there are a whole 8 missing generations between Madaluug and the first branching the Madaluug family tree.

Or of course there is the inevitable cynic's argument that Dir could be a different tribe from Hawiye entirely, and Irir is a confederation. This particular possibility could be tested with DNA genealogical testing. If true, this simply creates more questions than answers really, but the truth is often more complicated than people think.

- James Dahl
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